[freenet-dev] Positive feedback for once

[Matthew Toseland]

An interesting IRC log...

[00:04] <haypo> no fuzzing. i just want to try freenet
[00:04] <haypo> it's a little bit faster than two years ago
[00:41] <toad_> <haypo> it's a little bit faster than two years ago
[00:41] <toad_> woooh!
[00:41] <toad_> :)
[00:53] <Kiit> toad_, good work, btw. Things seem to be much more smooth and 
fast than they were last time I tried freenet.
[00:53] <toad_> Kiit: two people telling me things have improved in an hour? 
there's something going on here... you must be an impostor!
[00:54] <Kiit> I've actually been able to download things within a few hours 
of starting up my node.
[00:54] <toad_> thanks anyway :)
[00:54] <toad_> Kiit: did you ever use 0.5?
[00:54] * Kiit goes off to donate some money.
[00:54] <Kiit> Yes
[00:54] <toad_> Kiit: it had a long "assimilation" period...
[00:54] <Kiit> Quite.
[00:54] <toad_> Kiit: you have darknet peers? or #freenet-refs refs?
[00:55] <Kiit> #freenet-refs so far, afaik.
[00:55] <toad_> if you happen to know a few people who are well established, 
that will help a lot
[00:55] <toad_> really? and it's still faster than 0.5? cool
[00:55] <Kiit> I expect so. I'm planning on exchanging refs over frost in a 
bit.
[00:55] <Kiit> Well, 0.5 varied alot speedwise for me.
[00:56] <toad_> 0.7 will too, it depends on the file
[00:56] <cbrannon> toad_: that was my experience too.  I was downloading with 
reasonable speed, as soon as I got a few peers.  Much more quickly than 0.5.
[00:56] <toad_> cbrannon: yeah...
[00:56] <Kiit> There were a few versions that I could pull things quicker than 
what I'm experiencing at the moment, but overall, it was slower and less 
reliable than right now.
[00:57] <toad_> cbrannon: opennet may well be better than 0.5's opennet was in 
terms of assimilation speed... but it's probably necessary for other reasons 
(network topology issues)
[00:57] * toad_ will post this conversation to devl :)
[00:59] <Kiit> Granted, this is all subjective.... :)
[01:00] <toad_> yeah, it's certainly true that if you know several folk 
already on freenet you can get a fast and secure connection quickly
[01:00] <toad_> the problem is 99% of our new users come from slashdot etc
[01:00] <toad_> and don't know anyone on freenet
[01:01] <toad_> organic growth doesn't happen enough to offset the 80% of 
users who come, find that they have to use IRC to get refs, conclude that it 
is both too much hassle and insecure, and go away
[01:01] <toad_> of course they're right about it being insecure...
[01:02] <cbrannon> The refbots were pretty good.  There were at least 3 in 
#freenet-refs when I started, so getting onto the network was fairly trivial.
[01:02] <toad_> hmmm interesting
[01:03] <cbrannon> It's just not hard to type "/msg refbot addref blabla"
[01:03] <toad_> true
[01:03] <toad_> but you have to register first
[01:03] <toad_> with nickserv
[01:03] <toad_> 99% of people don't know and won't do it even if they do know
[01:03] <toad_> for much the same reason: it is intuitively insecure
[01:04] <cbrannon> My policy was to add many peers quickly.  Security in 
numbers?
[01:05] <toad_> not really
[01:05] <Kiit> It would be interesting to modify the refbots so that they used 
#freenet-refs to grab "tier 2" peers and then when one had enough, use frost 
w/ encryption to get "tier 1" peers.
[01:05] <toad_> but there is speed in numbers :)
[01:05] <toad_> tier 2?
[01:06] <Kiit> tier 2 being arguably less secure irc-obtained auto-peers
[01:07] <cbrannon> Heh, can you really ever trust an opennet at all, anyway?
[01:07] <Kiit> this is based on the document "How to exchange node refs more 
securely" @ 
http://127.0.0.1:8888/USK@8b7wZHMx1ACXjVRRc00RigvNpCGKN3atbtcPb5rlksY,~HFub4S23G5GYltu53XRexzbos7vLX7tG0GxjRJmFKg,AQACAAE/refXchgHOWTO/2/
[01:07] <cbrannon> Because somewhere, you need a central server, don't you?  
And that server could be attacked.
[01:08] <toad_> cbrannon: can you trust #freenet-refs?
[01:08] <toad_> there is a central server (network)
[01:09] <cbrannon> toad_: nope.
[01:09] <toad_> *.freenode.net
[01:10] <cbrannon> That's true.  You really can't trust anyone that you don't 
know offline
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