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[0:55] <dynam> Anyone here reasonably knowledgable about how Freenet works?
[1:01] <Ralith> OctobersDark seems to be.
[1:02] <dynam> Harumph
[1:24] <colione> OctobersDark, knows nothing.. :p
[1:24] <colione> he is just like a big puppy
[1:24] <colione> :D
[1:25] <Ralith> hehe.
[1:25] <OctobersDark> hey!
[1:25] <colione> bork!
[1:25] <OctobersDark> bork
[1:25] <OctobersDark> I didn't expect to see chat here
[1:25] <OctobersDark> this is a serious channel
[1:26] <colione> like the refs channel isnt? :p
[1:26] <OctobersDark> yeah, but this gets logged and posted FOREVER on the www
[1:27] <OctobersDark> where is the big dog anyway
[1:28] <OctobersDark> astonishing amouny of folks in the refs channel that have not read the topic it seems today
[1:28] <OctobersDark> maybe I'm just gettin jaded
[1:29] <Ralith> heh
[1:30] <OctobersDark> dynam: what is troubling yuo?
[1:30] <Ralith> people usually don't
[1:30] <OctobersDark> true that Ralith
[1:31] <OctobersDark> nice job colione, you killed dynam
[1:32] <OctobersDark> seems colione and dynam stepped out...
[1:32] * NullAcht15 (n=NullAcht@) Quit (Remote closed the connection)
[1:33] <dynam> hi
[1:33] <dynam> What's up?
[1:33] <OctobersDark> howdy.
[1:33] <dynam> Oh
[1:33] <dynam> waht was it,
[1:33] <dynam> OH
[1:33] <dynam> haha, I was wondering if I move my location, will I have to update my refs?
[1:33] <Ralith> I've moved between here and school
[1:33] <Ralith> both places have restrictive NATs
[1:33] <Ralith> and completely different IPs
[1:34] <Ralith> no problem connecting from either
[1:34] <Ralith> didn't do anything special to make it work
[1:34] <dynam> Ah good, I'm moving considerably father than school
[1:35] <Ralith> random thought
[1:35] <OctobersDark> peaches
[1:35] <dynam> further*
[1:35] <dynam> I can't type today
[1:35] <dynam> I blame the meth
[1:35] <Ralith> why not have an option that defaults to off that allows you to send peers who also have the option set a list of your peers
[1:35] <Ralith> without IPs, if at all possible
[1:36] <Ralith> in fact, with just the bare minimum info to connect.
[1:36] <Ralith> once you had a few peers it'd make it a lot easier to get as many as you wanted, and if you're paranoid you can keep your info private
[1:36] <Ralith> but you don't benefit from the automated system that way, so there's incentive.
[1:36] <OctobersDark> without IP's...how are they going to find each other?
[1:36] <Ralith> same way they already do?
[1:37] <dynam> The same way anonymous proxies work?
[1:38] <OctobersDark> I think Ralith, that when YOU change IPs it is cool because you can stilll find somebody send out an ark requsest, but if nobody has IPs they couldn't initially find each other--just a wild guess on my part
[1:38] <Ralith> ah.
[1:39] <OctobersDark> that may be why it is ok for one to change IP occassionally, I don't really "know"
[1:39] <toad_> Ralith: the minimum info to connect does include IP addresses
[1:39] <Ralith> well, with IP then
[1:39] <Ralith> :P
[1:40] <toad_> Ralith: so what you want is a way to tell your friends about your other friends, basically?
[1:40] <toad_> s/friends/peers :)
[1:40] <Ralith> pretty much
[1:40] <Ralith> in an opt-in basis
[1:40] <toad_> yeah, it's been suggested
[1:40] <Ralith> so that way noone can complain about security :P
[1:41] <toad_> well, there are issues always
[1:41] <toad_> e.g. if peers are propagated from one node to the next to the next, then it's an opennet, and harvestable
[1:41] <Ralith> oh, and it should only send peer info for those who have opted in, of course
[1:41] <Ralith> hm.
[1:41] <toad_> of course
[1:41] <toad_> so we have two options
[1:41] <toad_> one is permanent, mutual introduction of friends
[1:41] <Ralith> well, it'd be basically an opt in opennet then.
[1:41] <toad_> primarily to be used for forwarding connections to people you already know
[1:42] <toad_> the other is connecting to your friend's friends, without making them full peers (and without forwarding them to your other peers)
[1:42] <Ralith> idea
[1:42] * Hakim_Bey_zzZZzz is now known as Hakim_Bey
[1:42] <Ralith> when a peer is contacted, it sends whether or not it wants more peers
[1:42] <toad_> yeah, there's a thread about it on devl
[1:42] <Ralith> the local node decides whether or not it deserves it
[1:43] <toad_> well
[1:43] <Ralith> if so, send info for this peer (if enabled) and other peers who have opted in
[1:43] <toad_> true opennet will be implemented in a few months
[1:43] <Ralith> up to a locally configured max, or until the other end reports having enough
[1:43] <toad_> if i mention this sort of schemes to ian he just says opennet
[1:43] <Ralith> :P
[1:43] <Ralith> alright then.
[1:43] <sanity> toad_: you know me so well :-)
[1:44] <Ralith> so how's the planned opennet scheme going to work?
[1:44] <toad_> Ralith: same as on 0.5, mostly
[1:44] <Ralith> I've heard it'll be voluntary and interoperable somehow.
[1:44] <Ralith> I'm new, so that means nothing :P
[1:44] <toad_> Ralith: based on path folding and LRU connection dropping
[1:44] <toad_> Ralith: it will be opt-in yes
[1:44] <Ralith> I'm also newby when it comes to darknets :P
[1:45] <Ralith> so could you, say, opt in for the first few days, and once you have enough peers opt out and be safe?
[1:45] <toad_> not really
[1:45] <toad_> you're not safe because your peers you got from opennet aren't safe
[1:45] <toad_> and anyway you need to stay in to be a real part of opennet
[1:45] <toad_> which they'll expect you to do
[1:45] <Ralith> so how does the opennet relate to the darknet?
[1:45] <toad_> it doesn't really
[1:45] <toad_> a node can participate in both
[1:45] * Ralith considers the darknet thing to be the main attraction.
[1:46] <Imcensored1> the way i see it... if you opt back out... u'd lose any non full peers... right?
[1:46] <Ralith> so will data be theoretically, at least, accessable from both sides to both sides?
[1:46] <toad_> yeah that's the idea
[1:47] <Ralith> sounds good to me.
[1:47] * MikeW (i=Mike@) Quit ()
[1:48] <toad_> the idea is just that opennet is a way to get lots of nodes
[1:48] <Ralith> paranoid people like me can use the opennet for slightly safer node gathering and such
[1:48] <toad_> once we've got lots of nodes, then hopefully people you know will be on freenet
[1:48] <Ralith> and then switch to darknet once we have other darknodes
[1:48] <toad_> Ralith: use the opennet for bootstrapping
[1:48] <Ralith> exactly
[1:48] <toad_> darknet for security
[1:48] <toad_> because opennet is not secure
[1:48] <Ralith> also makes it easier for not-so-serious types to get in on things
[1:48] <Ralith> might help the project grow
[1:49] <Ralith> maybe offer another download with a security warning that has opennet enabled by default
[1:49] <Imcensored1> but isnt there a limit as to how many nodes you want connected...
[1:49] <Imcensored1> i get better results with just 10 nodes connected than 40 nodes
[1:50] <Ralith> easier to get up and running with the opennet and then grab some darknetness when you can/want to than to wait a while for decent performance gathering darknet nodes here
[1:51] <OctobersDark> "darknetness" I like that :-)
[1:53] <toad_> :)
[1:53] <_ph00> on the other hand, having darknet only forces new users to get in touch with other users, which could be useful in (a probabaly near) future, when freenet will need to run on true darknet (only known and trusted ppl). In a couple of year of hanging around #freenet-<whatever> you will know at least a bunch of people you could trust at least a bit
[1:53] <_ph00> but
[1:53] <_ph00> looks like it's decided already, so...
[1:53] <toad_> _ph00: it may be better to get a mass audience in the short term
[1:54] <Ralith> _ph00, with a large audience, that will actually be easier.
[1:54] <_ph00> yeah. you have a point there
[1:54] <toad_> _ph00: and i don't see irc channels forcing peole to get to know people
[1:54] <Ralith> as more people will get to know eachother
[1:54] <Ralith> and some will always be in the darknet
[1:54] <toad_> right, if we have opennet, then there are more possible darknet conns
[1:54] <toad_> it's then a matter of making it worth users' while, and explaining that security is much improved on darknet
[1:54] <Ralith> and in the end the darknet expands faster
[1:55] <Ralith> yeah
[1:55] <_ph00> toad_; what I meant was that if you must exchange refs you will get in touch with some ppl who run freenet
[1:55] <toad_> _ph00: true, but they might be NSA
[1:55] <toad_> okay, it works
[1:55] <toad_> now i can go to bed, yay
[1:55] <Ralith> hehe
[1:55] <Ralith> night
[1:55] <_ph00> well, the opennet peers could too
[1:55] <_ph00> k
[1:55] <_ph00> night
[1:55] <OctobersDark> nn
[1:55] <Ralith> _ph00, that's why you only use darknet people you trust
[1:55] <Ralith> someone somewhere will trust a darknet guy
[1:55] <Ralith> and get on
[1:55] <Ralith> then he'll trust people
[1:55] <Ralith> and so on
[1:56] <Ralith> so everyone ends up with connections after a while
[1:56] <Ralith> for the most part.
[1:56] * toad_ will commit his changes first
[1:57] <_ph00> if I get it right, right now the 'grow-fast' priority is more important than the 'trusted-peers' priority (mostly because ppl connect to strangers anyways) so opennet has a reason to be implemented. That, and a lot of people *wanting* opennet.
[1:58] <Ralith> in the places where people need to connect only to trusted peers, they can :P
[1:58] <Ralith> around here, at least right now, I can just connect to a bunch of peers and know that at least most of them are clean
[1:59] <_ph00> and in a couple of years, when we will need to connect to trusted peers only, will will be able to do that too
[1:59] <Ralith> and if more people hear of freenet, if/when a large-scale darknet becomes truly necessary, it will happen faster, bigger, and so on.
[1:59] <Ralith> yeah, and there'll be more people who know eachother and freenet
[1:59] <_ph00> that was my point
[1:59] <toad_> but none of this can happen until we've sorted out load limiting
[2:00] <Ralith> :P
[2:00] <Ralith> is that going along well?
[2:00] <Imcensored1> but at that point... do u think it'll be possible for "clicks" to happen...like having several large groups that are not connected to each other
[2:00] <Ralith> Imcensored1, of course. It's possible and even likely now.
[2:00] <Ralith> and they may be intentional.
[2:00] <_ph00> yes, I get it. as long as ppl connect with strangers on -refs, it's basically as unsafe as running opennet, so what the hell, let's do that, at least for a while
[2:00] <Ralith> if not, then they may connect to eachother eventually
[2:02] <Ralith> by the way
[2:02] <Ralith> if anyone has a non-freenet link for the frost alpha (or a freenet link that actually /works/), that would be much appreciated
[2:03] <Imcensored1> too bad a network hub cant be set up... kinda like a relay station so that data can be shared between non-connected groups... but the thought of that just kills security...
[2:03] <Imcensored1> so thats never gonna happen
[2:04] <CIA-14> toad * r10979 /trunk/freenet/src/freenet/ (13 files in 4 dirs): Major refactoring of auto-update code. Now support auto-updating freenet-ext.jar.
[2:04] <toad_> committed
[2:04] <toad_> please test 10979 if you can
[2:04] <toad_> thanks
[2:04] <OctobersDark> put me in charge of the hub. trust me.
[2:04] <toad_> it'll be auto-built in a few minutes
[2:05] <toad_> then you can get it from downloads.freenetproject.org (the testing latest, or fetch it explicitly by number)
[2:05] <Ralith> toad_, so just shut down our node, download it, and start it again?
[2:05] <OctobersDark> ok toad_
[2:05] <Ralith> Imcensored1, 'hubs' don't need to exist
[2:05] <Ralith> all you need is one individual who has a peer from each group
[2:05] <toad_> Ralith: yep
[2:05] <Ralith> or multiple ones, for better connections
[2:05] <toad_> ok
[2:06] <toad_> good night
[2:06] <Ralith> toad_, cool.
[2:06] <Ralith> night
[2:06] * JustMe will grab r10979
[2:06] <Imcensored1> i'll try it... but as a second node...
[2:07] <toad_> it auto-updates both the main jar and freenet-ext.jar
[2:07] <toad_> that's the main functional change
[2:07] <toad_> there's a lot of refactoring supporting that
[2:07] * Ralith is impressed by the automation in this system
[2:07] * toad_ supposes since there isn't a new build yet, you can't really test it...
[2:08] <toad_> Ralith: hey, we're geeks! :)
[2:08] <Ralith> hehe
[2:08] <Ralith> even so, most projects don't have quite as nice an auto upload-build-mirror system
[2:08] <Ralith> let alone with IRC status messages
[2:08] <Ralith> you should organize the code and put it up somewhere.
[2:08] <toad_> well, CIA isn't our invention
[2:08] <Ralith> FreenetLogBot probably is.
[2:09] <toad_> possibly
[2:09] <toad_> ask nextgens, it's his code
[2:09] * toad_ just hopes it's all in his backups
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[2:41] <Imcensored1> 10979 looks a lot like freenet .05
[2:41] <Ralith> no, it doesn't :P
[2:42] <Ralith> looks just like the previous one
[2:42] <Imcensored1> it brought up the same config page
[2:43] <Ralith> looks like it used to to me
[2:44] <Imcensored1> maybe cause i installed it to a new folder and used the install program to download the additional files needed
[2:44] <Imcensored1> my .07 doesnt have a system tray icon and doesnt allow me to configure the note except on telnet and on darknet
[2:44] <Imcensored1> *node
[2:45] <Imcensored1> imma try to reinstall it over my existing node
[2:46] <Ralith> that's what I did
[2:46] <Ralith> just overwrote freenet-latest-stable.jar
[2:46] <Ralith> or whatever it was
[2:51] <Imcensored1> wow that didnt work
[2:51] <Imcensored1> i should have done that in the first place
[2:51] <Imcensored1> blah
[2:51] <Imcensored1> windows sucks
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[2:54] <Imcensored1> okai... fixed it... back to 10936 ... trying again
[2:57] <Imcensored1> Ralith .. what exactly did you download
[2:57] <Ralith> 10979 iirc
[2:58] <Imcensored1> i mean URL
[2:58] <Ralith> http://downloads.freenetproject.org/alpha/freenet-r10979-snapshot.jar
[2:58] <Imcensored1> oh okai.. i was in emu.freenetprject.org ...
[2:59] <Ralith> it's the same
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[3:03] <Imcensored1> okai i did that... but darknet still reports version 10936
[3:04] <Ralith> you have to shut it down first, then upgrade, then start it up
[3:04] <Imcensored1> thats what i did
[3:06] <Ralith> restart it again? :P
[3:06] <Ralith> my homepage says: Freenet 0.7 Build #998 r10979
[3:16] <Imcensored1> still not working
[3:17] <Imcensored1> im hesitant to run the windows installer for it ... i dont want to accidently lose my config as it stands
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[3:26] <Imcensored1> i give up
[3:33] <edt> down load the freenet-r10979-snapshot.jar, stop freenet, then rename it to freenet.jar and restart
[3:34] <Imcensored1> ooooh ... i was replacing the "freenet-stable-llatest.jar"
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[3:40] <Imcensored1> that works thx
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[5:03] * IMCensored1 is away -(- Out and About - Leave a Msg)- At 12:00:32 AM Eastern Standard Time
[5:03] <IMCensored1> blah.. everytime i use my IRC client i have to turn that feature off...
[5:04] <Ralith> :P
[5:04] <Ralith> get a new irc client?
[5:04] <IMCensored1> thats work
[5:04] <IMCensored1> =P
[5:04] <IMCensored1> i dont intend on closing it anytime soon so i should be good
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[8:05] <nextgens> Ralith> hi
[8:06] <nextgens> the point most people don't get is :
[8:06] <nextgens> once you have been even only once on opennet; your reference can have been harvested
[8:06] <nextgens> and going darknet afterwards won't help you, except it will help the routing
[8:07] <nextgens> as darknet links are expected to be more reliable and less subject to churn than opennet ones
[8:07] <phrosty> opennet been finished yet?
[8:08] <nextgens> on .5, yes
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[8:35] <CIA-14> nextgens * r10980 /trunk/freenet/src/freenet/ (3 files in 2 dirs):
[8:35] <CIA-14> * increase the NodeStarter.RECOMMENDED_EXT_BUILD_NUMBER value to 7
[8:35] <CIA-14> * display the NodeStarter.RECOMMENDED_EXT_BUILD_NUMBER value on the WelcomeToadlet
[8:35] <CIA-14> * remove a useless null string
[8:40] * nextgens has spotted a bug in toad's latest commit
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[8:50] <CIA-14> nextgens * r10981 /trunk/freenet/src/freenet/node/updater/NodeUpdaterManager.java: Updater : we should start looking for new revisions starting at NodeStarter.extBuildNumber ; maybe we should update ExtOldAgeUserAlert too
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[9:01] <nextgens> hmmm
[9:02] <nextgens> I'll let toad fix it
[9:02] <nextgens> I don't understand what he was willing to do
[9:02] <nextgens> "Update Failed: Could not determine which jars are in use: Could not find freenet jar in wrapper.conf (did find freenet-ext.jar: freenet-ext.jar)"
[9:03] <nextgens> my freenet jar beeing "freenet.jar"
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[9:11] <CIA-14> nextgens * r10982 /trunk/freenet/src/freenet/node/updater/UpdateDeployContext.java: Simplify the code and try to solve the problem I experienced on my node
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[9:19] [freenode-connect VERSION]
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[9:38] <nextgens> hmmm
[9:38] <nextgens> I've broken it in fact
[9:39] <nextgens> "Update Failed: Cannot rewrite wrapper.conf: java.io.IOException: Not able to update because of non-standard config: written main=false ext=true - should not happen! Report this to the devs, include your wrapper.conf" isn't any better
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[10:16] <sleon> nextgens: ok will update now
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[10:22] <hopeatikari> hi all
[10:24] <sleon> hopeatikari: hi
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[10:57] <hopeatikari> what that generate thread dump means at statistics page
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[11:35] <- *HugTheLemur* hello
[11:35] <- *HugTheLemur* can i please get a noderef?
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[12:53] <CIA-14> mrogers * r10983 /trunk/apps/load-balancing-sims/phase7/sim/ (6 files in 2 dirs): CHK inserts were occasionally being logged as both successes and failures
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[13:05] <Muixirt> hi
[13:06] <HugTheLemur> heya
[13:07] <Muixirt> the USK@wEiRdCharS.../foobar/-1/ thingy seems to be broken, right?
[13:09] <nextgens> false
[13:10] <Muixirt> nextgens, thank you for this in-depth answer :-)
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[13:11] <nextgens> I guess it's as deep as your statement
[13:12] <Muixirt> i remember times then this was good for getting the latest edition within minutes instead of hours or days or ...
[13:12] <nextgens> use a positive number then
[13:15] <Muixirt> nextgens, you can't confirm that using negative numbers is more time consuming than it used to be?
[13:16] <nextgens> I dunno if it's worst than it used to be ... but I know it's slower than positive ones
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[13:22] <Muixirt> if there is a USK@wEiRdCharS.../foobar/33/ is there a SSK@@wEiRdCharS.../foobar/33/ ?
[13:22] <nextgens> no
[13:22] <Muixirt> SSK@ not SSK@@
[13:23] <nextgens> there is a SSK@wEiRdCharS.../foobar-33/
[13:23] <nextgens> what are you trying to do ?
[13:23] <nextgens> can't you use positive numbers ?
[13:24] <Muixirt> nothing particular, but what was the point of USKs and negative numbers?
[13:25] <nextgens> to ensure you have the latest edition ... but that assumes you aren't in a hurry nor expecting to get a result quickly
[13:26] <Muixirt> was the code implementing this changed?
[13:26] <nextgens> it has been fixed around 996 iirc
[13:27] <nextgens> bbiab
[13:28] <Muixirt> all i say tha with earlier build this gave you the latest editions of freesites in minutes, now it takes ages (at least hours)
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[13:43] <CIA-14> mrogers * r10984 /trunk/apps/load-balancing-sims/phase7/sim/handlers/ChkInsertHandler.java: Some CHK inserts were still being double-counted
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[13:57] <oddy> anyone here ?
[13:59] <HugTheLemur> yep
[13:59] <HugTheLemur> heya
[13:59] <oddy> oh hello
[13:59] <oddy> Im new to this freenet
[14:00] <oddy> it says I need a peer
[14:00] <HugTheLemur> cool :-)
[14:00] <HugTheLemur> yes, you do
[14:00] <HugTheLemur> pls join #freenet-refs
[14:00] <HugTheLemur> we can exchange noderefs there
[14:00] <oddy> ahhh
[14:07] <k610> so if my refs are related to my person and your refs are related to your person if somebody on top of all of us keeps all the links made between a ref and a person that person could redraw the whole network and know all the content browsed and sended by any peers of this darknet network
[14:08] <HugTheLemur> well, actually, no... since if you are connected to me and you get a request from me you don't know it's really from me
[14:08] <MineHaunter> true for the first part, false the second
[14:08] <HugTheLemur> yeah
[14:08] <MineHaunter> if you keep track of the links you could map the network
[14:09] <CIA-14> mrogers * r10985 /trunk/apps/load-balancing-sims/phase7/sim/handlers/ChkInsertHandler.java: Some CHK inserts weren't being counted at all...
[14:09] <MineHaunter> but this doesn't mean that you automatically discover what's being transferred
[14:09] <MineHaunter> afaik you could do some timing attacks but nothing more
[14:11] <k610> what do you mean by request ? if i browse something trough your peer you cannot findout that i browsed it trough you or even what has been browsed
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[15:05] <toad_> bbiab
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[15:36] <nextgens> hi toad_
[15:36] <nextgens> toad_> I've just posted the small summary you wanted me to do
[15:36] <nextgens> toad_> I've spotted two possible bugs in the new updating code
[15:37] <nextgens> toad_> it seems that the status of the updater goes back after some time ; I dunno what it's doing ... maybe re-checking the revokation uri ?
[15:38] <nextgens> toad_> and the second one is a problem with the wrapper.conf parser ... it doesn't work for me ... I've tried to fix it but haven't managed to without eclipse
[15:38] <nextgens> maybe you could have a look
[15:39] <nextgens> it says :
[15:39] <nextgens> Update Failed: Cannot rewrite wrapper.conf: java.io.IOException: Not able
[15:39] <nextgens> to update because of non-standard config: written main=false ext=true -
[15:39] <nextgens> should not happen! Report this to the devs, include your wrapper.conf"
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[15:53] <GeneralBush2005> I need refs.
[15:53] <fasta> GeneralBush2005: nah, you need to read the topic
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[15:55] <GeneralBush2005> I have read the Topic.
[15:55] <GeneralBush2005> no one answers there
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[16:26] <kryten4k> help!
[16:26] <kryten4k> how does one see a file that someone makes a reference to using chk@..... ?
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[16:37] <syd3> am i right that the file-list of an page is - theoretically - available in the manifest? Can old manifests still be accessed?
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[16:42] <syd3> anyone knows? the problem is - i inserted a private file with my page - its linked nowhere but i?m concerned it may be accessed through the manifest
[16:47] <kryten4k> how does one see a file that someone makes a reference to using chk@..... ?
[16:48] <syd3> ?
[16:49] <warpi> how many connections should one have?
[16:50] <Muixirt> syd3, it doesn't sound very diffficult to extent freenet with a fcp function to look into these manifests.
[16:50] <syd3> and old manifests can still be accessed?
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[16:51] <Muixirt> kryten4k, you must have the chk@ key to verify if that file exists on freenet
[16:52] <Muixirt> syd3, what old manifests? from .5 ?
[16:52] <syd3> no, from .7
[16:52] <syd3> but i already updated the site with freesitemgr
[16:53] <syd3> now i get edition 2 if i access the usk@ which does not contain the file
[16:53] <Muixirt> syd3, i have no clue how it is implemented in .7 or whether these things have changed, but i think a freenet hacker it would be easy to find your private file
[16:54] <syd3> .. any other way to delete it? i have the private key
[16:54] <MineHaunter> syd3: actually there is no way from a client to discover your private file but if you hack the node software you can read the whole manifest
[16:54] <MineHaunter> future version of freenet may allow clients to read manifests
[16:55] <MineHaunter> so your file isn't really hidden
[16:55] <MineHaunter> you can't delete a key, that's the way freenet is implemented
[16:55] <syd3> hmpf
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[16:56] <Muixirt> syd3, i hope for you that this site is not cp :-)
[16:57] <syd3> no, the page is just a private one, the private file is an sql-dump with some passwords ..
[16:57] <kryten4k> Help, how does one see a file that someone makes a reference to using chk@..... ?
[16:57] <syd3> shouldnt have copied it there
[16:57] <MineHaunter> syd3: did you distribute they key to the site?
[16:57] <syd3> no
[16:57] <syd3> not yet
[16:57] <MineHaunter> then don't
[16:58] <MineHaunter> if you don't give away the key no one will be able to access that data
[16:58] <MineHaunter> just reinsert the site under a different key
[16:58] <MineHaunter> without the compromising file :)
[16:58] <syd3> great news
[16:58] <syd3> :)
[16:58] <syd3> thank you
[16:58] <MineHaunter> :)
[17:00] <Muixirt> syd3, so your freesite isn't public, even earlier editions?
[17:00] <syd3> no, it was just another test-site
[17:00] <syd3> hello-world style
[17:01] <Muixirt> syd3, the spiders will find it >:-)
[17:01] <syd3> argh .. seems like i get lots of work changing all my passwords .. and my bank account
[17:03] <syd3> :-) i start dislikeing freenet
[17:03] <Muixirt> syd3, there is no fool-proof software ;-)
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[17:12] <kryten4k> Help, how does one see a file that someone makes a reference to using chk@..... ?
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[17:13] <Muixirt> kryten4k, have i missed the point?
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[17:20] <digger3> Is it normal for a node to relatively slowly accumulate data? I'm running for 3 days and have cached 684mb
[17:22] <Muixirt> hi digger3, what is yout input/outpu rate?
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[17:25] <kryten4k> Well Muixirt, I see some posts with the reference to a file using for example: CHK@V3edSeIVuiPzhP13H2BMjUtADLAy~LX2wo-x~uP4BBc,JS95ZnvugMrxWRUaSxtmITblj7VD3VTkdfgCkQ3fozI,AAEC--8/relazione_locri1.pdf
[17:27] <Muixirt> kryten4k, and you tried to download that chk@ key? your node can't find it?
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[17:28] <digger3> Muixirt: input: 648Bps, output: 520 Bps
[17:28] <Muixirt> digger3, and you wonder why your node isn't collecting data fast enough?
[17:29] <digger3> yes, at least I assume that it should be faster, but I may be wrong about that
[17:33] <toad_> nextgens: do you have a standard wrapper.conf?
[17:34] <Muixirt> digger3, maybe due to your position in the network (leaf node)
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[17:35] <toad_> Muixirt: syd3: no they won't if it's not linked from anything
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[17:36] <Muixirt> toad_, but a tweaked node would spill out the manifest and one would see that file
[17:37] <toad_> Muixirt: sure but if he hasn't announced the site, he's fine
[17:38] <digger3> Muixirt: perhaps :)
[17:38] <Muixirt> toad_, sure he said that, but ...
[17:38] <MineHaunter> Muixirt: your affermation is false. spiders can't find site keys if they don't get posted somewhere
[17:38] <Muixirt> MineHaunter, i was only kidding syd3
[17:38] <MineHaunter> that's cruel :D
[17:40] * toad_ agrees
[17:43] <CIA-14> toad * r10986 /trunk/freenet/src/freenet/node/updater/NodeUpdaterManager.java: Fix NPE.
[17:43] <MineHaunter> iirc in freenet 0.5, for SSK keys, there was a public key part and an encryption part and you could use only the public key or both combined
[17:44] <MineHaunter> is 0.7 using the same principle?
[17:44] <Muixirt> the bottom line: please devls implement a fcp command for inspecting manifests, there is more stuff than one might think :-)
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[17:59] <kryten4k> Muixirt, i went to http://localhost:8888/ and entered SSK@L119pUWpjJZrMBo40EZ42DPPtYMPAgM/FreeNova// in the key field and got "Error: Invalid URI: Wrong extra bytes"
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[18:00] <Muixirt> kryten4k, that seems to be a .5 link
[18:00] <kryten4k> scuse my lack of knowledge, but what does that mean Mui?
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[18:06] <nextgens> toad_> on downloads.fp
[18:06] <nextgens> I need to go, sorry
[18:06] <nextgens> bbl
[18:07] <Muixirt> kryten4k, there is a freenet .5 network and a .7 network, you can't access data from the other network, they are incompatible
[18:08] <toad_> nextgens: what is?
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[18:08] <toad_> nextgens: oh i see ok
[18:09] <hopeatikari> hi all
[18:10] <CIA-14> toad * r10987 /trunk/freenet/src/freenet/node/updater/ (NodeUpdater.java NodeUpdaterManager.java): Revocation URI not necessary on NodeUpdater.
[18:10] <hopeatikari> by the way what that generate a thread dump means at statistics page
[18:10] <Muixirt> toad_, i asked nextgens about problems getting freesites via USK@wEiRdCharS.../foobar/-1/
[18:11] <toad_> hopeatikari: it tells us what is going on in each thread
[18:11] <toad_> hopeatikari: it's a debugging option
[18:11] <toad_> it prints a stack dump to the wrapper.log
[18:11] <toad_> we may ask people to use it if they're having certain types of problems
[18:11] <Muixirt> toad_, maybe you know whether there has changed something
[18:12] <hopeatikari> aha okay
[18:13] <toad_> Muixirt: whats the problem?
[18:14] <Muixirt> toad_, with earlier build i got a response within minutes, now not even in hours :-(
[18:14] <kryten4k> k, thanks Muixirt
[18:14] <toad_> Muixirt: earlier builds = builds up to when?
[18:14] <Muixirt> say 990?
[18:14] <toad_> hmmm
[18:15] <toad_> ok
[18:15] <toad_> will debug
[18:17] <toad_> nextgens: "the status of the updater goes back" - i don't understand. what is true is that if it downloads an update, and you don't allow it to fire within 2 minutes, it will need to re-fetch the revocation key when you arm it. that's intentional.
[18:21] <CIA-14> toad * r10988 /trunk/freenet/src/freenet/node/updater/UpdateDeployContext.java: Fix wrapper.conf rewrite fail when only one jar is being updated.
[18:21] <kryten4k> Where can you get a listing of boards (not default to frost)?
[18:23] <kryten4k> freenetlogbot, what is r10988 (998)???
[18:24] <CIA-14> toad * r10989 /trunk/freenet/src/freenet/node/updater/NodeUpdaterManager.java: Kill update fetchers when key blown. Check for key blown slightly earlier.
[18:25] <CIA-14> toad * r10990 /trunk/freenet/src/freenet/node/updater/NodeUpdaterManager.java: And null out the updaters too (turns off node.updater when freenet.ini next written out; this is a proportionate response imho to a key being blown).
[18:25] <toad_> kryten4k: the globe icon
[18:25] <toad_> kryten4k: join the boards board if you haven't already
[18:25] <toad_> kryten4k: SVN version 10988, build number 998
[18:28] <kryten4k> Toad, thanks but I don't know what u are talking about?
[18:31] <CIA-14> toad * r10991 /trunk/freenet/src/freenet/node/updater/NodeUpdaterManager.java: Comment fix.
[18:37] <CIA-14> toad * r10992 /trunk/freenet/src/freenet/node/updater/ (NodeUpdater.java NodeUpdaterManager.java): Make changing the URI work.
[18:39] <CIA-14> toad * r10993 /trunk/freenet/src/freenet/node/updater/NodeUpdaterManager.java: Move a method around.
[18:41] <CIA-14> toad * r10994 /trunk/freenet/src/freenet/node/updater/NodeUpdaterManager.java: Some more moving methods around.
[18:42] <CIA-14> toad * r10995 /trunk/freenet/src/freenet/node/updater/NodeUpdaterManager.java: Fix NPE in rare race case.
[18:43] <CIA-14> toad * r10996 /trunk/freenet/src/freenet/node/updater/NodeUpdaterManager.java: More NPE paranoia.
[18:45] <CIA-14> toad * r10997 /trunk/freenet/src/freenet/node/updater/NodeUpdaterManager.java: Document a couple of methods.
[18:47] <CIA-14> toad * r10998 /trunk/freenet/src/freenet/node/updater/RevocationChecker.java: Comment.
[18:53] <CIA-14> toad * r10999 /trunk/freenet/src/freenet/node/updater/RevocationChecker.java: Trivial optimisation
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[18:55] <CIA-14> toad * r11000 /trunk/freenet/src/freenet/node/updater/RevocationChecker.java: Reset revocation DNF counter, so that when it reaches 3 again it will again trigger a success notification.
[19:02] <CIA-14> toad * r11001 /trunk/freenet/src/freenet/node/updater/UpdateDeployContext.java: Another fix
[19:11] <toad_> bbl
[19:11] <toad_> might not be back until monday
[19:11] <toad_> cya
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[20:01] <Ralith> yay, got the new frost working
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[20:07] <imcensored1> new frost?
[20:08] <imcensored1> newer than the one bundled with freenet?
[20:08] <Ralith> yeah
[20:08] <Ralith> it's an alpha
[20:08] <Ralith> has fun things like threading
[20:08] <imcensored1> schweet
[20:08] <Ralith> which seems very well implemented
[20:08] * Ralith is just loading it and getting a few long trees with only the most recent post visible :P
[20:09] <imcensored1> i might have to go get that... but as the way things are going.. i might have to reinstall windblows =(
[20:10] <Ralith> :P
[20:10] <Ralith> <3 ubuntu linux
[20:10] <imcensored1> if it wont let me load cgywin .. it'll be time for a reinstall
[20:10] <imcensored1> <3 Fedora Core... i regret not using that over Win2k
[20:11] <_ph00> for a dual boot, I would suggest ubuntu
[20:11] <imcensored1> if i do it.. im not dual booting
[20:12] <_ph00> and I can point you to a nich "ultralight" version of winXP (I can't link iot here because it's not legal)
[20:12] <imcensored1> its gonna be on my next box im building..
[20:12] <imcensored1> i like 2k over XP though...
[20:12] <_ph00> ubuntu is good. As good as debian, witha a default 2.6 kernel and almost everything working out of the box
[20:13] <Ralith> better, at least for those who aren't linux gurus :P
[20:13] <_ph00> 2k won't let you run partition magic, for instance
[20:13] <_ph00> and that XP (the one I run for my gaming part) is as light as 2k. maybe lighter
[20:13] <Ralith> imcensored1, to be honest, fedora isn't a very good distro
[20:13] <Ralith> RPM hell is a pain
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[20:13] <_ph00> slackware is good
[20:13] <_ph00> debian is also good
[20:13] <imcensored1> i never really had a problem with it
[20:14] <Ralith> you will after a while.
[20:14] <_ph00> gentoo I herd many ppl arte happy with
[20:14] <Ralith> always pops up eventually
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[20:14] <Ralith> gentoo and debian derivatives are my recommendation
[20:14] <Ralith> ubuntu if you want life easy
[20:14] <Ralith> gentoo if you want optimization
[20:16] <_ph00> I run ubuntu because of the out-of-the box working stuff
[20:16] * Ralith nods.
[20:16] <Ralith> used to do gentoo, but all the maintenance pissed me off :P
[20:16] <_ph00> if you want stability, then you should run slackware
[20:16] <imcensored1> oh well.. i need to focus on getting off my lazy ass and installing Cygwin
[20:16] <_ph00> but, almost nothing works out of the box
[20:17] <Ralith> ehh, for stability a carefully assembled gentoo system would be better in the end
[20:17] <Ralith> you'd have to really know what you were doing, though
[20:20] <OctobersDark> does fat32 have a 4gig file limit?
[20:21] <OctobersDark> it does doesn't it?
[20:21] <imcensored1> i dont know... i went NTFS a long time ago... i pulled in a 7 gig file with it a while back...
[20:21] <imcensored1> i can look it up
[20:21] <Ralith> OctobersDark, think so
[20:21] <OctobersDark> yeah, I'm using a fat32 partition between my OS's as a sort of overflow area
[20:23] <OctobersDark> I don't ever boot to windows on this box, I need to just redo it all
[20:23] <Ralith> OctobersDark, you know, there /are/ ext2fs drivers for windows :P
[20:23] <imcensored1> file-size limit on FAT32 is (2^32)-1 bytes, or one byte less than a full 4GB
[20:23] <OctobersDark> aha
[20:24] <OctobersDark> that is why
[20:24] <OctobersDark> I'm extracting a 4.4g iso onto it and it keeps failing right at 4g
[20:24] <imcensored1> go in to windows and swap it over to NTFS
[20:24] <OctobersDark> bork that
[20:25] <OctobersDark> I'll just have to make some room
[20:25] <Ralith> or move everything elsewhere and just expand your ext3fs into it.
[20:25] <OctobersDark> I've got 4.2 gigs available on my ext3 drive, just need to move a couple of things over
[20:26] <OctobersDark> thanks for looking that up imcensored1
[20:26] <OctobersDark> that should be my paln Ralith
[20:26] <imcensored1> no problem
[20:26] <OctobersDark> er, plan
[20:27] <OctobersDark> I need to fire up the burner and get this stuff archived
[20:27] <Ralith> btw, I finally got frost downloaded :)
[20:27] <Ralith> worth the wait.
[20:27] <Ralith> <3 threading
[20:27] <OctobersDark> good.
[20:28] <OctobersDark> it has multiple personalities on the fly, which you will see some spammer has already found
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[20:29] <Ralith> yeah :P
[20:29] <Ralith> marked as bad long ago
[20:29] <OctobersDark> yep, bad,bad,bad
[20:31] <- *SamJohnson* can i please get voice?
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[20:55] <Ralith> ok, freenet is using almost all my CPU
[20:55] <Ralith> anything I can do about that?
[20:57] <Ralith> not to mention a big chunk of my ram
[20:57] <OctobersDark> may ot be freenet, stop frost and see what it looks like
[20:58] <Ralith> still a ton, but 1/3 the ton it used to be :P
[20:58] <OctobersDark> heh.
[20:58] <imcensored1> freenet almost never uses more then 2% of my CPU... but it uses up to 120 megs of ram at times...
[20:58] <Ralith> it's now using around 30% CPU and RAM on average
[20:58] <Ralith> ok, CPU's spiking again
[20:58] <OctobersDark> I read 'somewhere' that frost likes to be stopped and restarted occassionally
[20:58] <OctobersDark> hm
[20:58] <Ralith> but it's staying below 50% most of the time
[21:00] <OctobersDark> something to ask toad_ or nextgens about i suppose
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[21:13] <sandos> imcensored1, what kind of cpu?
[21:14] <imcensored1> Intel Pentium IV
[21:14] <sandos> ok
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[21:48] <Ralith> cutting down my output bandwidth seems to have helped
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[22:05] <|TYAN|> hi all
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[22:10] <|TYAN|> someone exchange ref?
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[22:13] <Ralith> wrong channel
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Irc logs of #freenet : 2008 2007 2006 2005
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