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[1:21] <matt_> lol i just saw frost on the bbc 24 news
[1:21] <matt_> or bbc news 24
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[2:01] <Anon5347> alguna latina
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[2:46] <tazzfr> hi all .
[2:47] <tazzfr> I am looking for node ref.
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[4:16] <Eol> nextgens: you around?
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[4:23] <Eol> any thaw folk around as nextgens is afk?
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[7:23] <Rym> :/
[7:23] <Rym> java keeps using more and more ram
[7:23] <Rym> any way i can stop this
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[7:43] <Rym> IS there a way I can limit the ram usage of freenet
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[9:39] <sleon> # Cache hits: 20,968 / 575,191 (3%)
[9:39] <sleon> # Store hits: 2,665 / 486,325 (0%)
[9:40] <sleon> #
[9:40] <sleon> # networkSizeEstimateSession: 1092 nodes
[9:40] <sleon> node uptime 2w10h
[9:40] <sleon> :)
[9:41] <slinky> sleon: what OS? what java?
[9:41] <sleon> slinky: linux
[9:41] <sleon> java is 1.5.07
[9:41] <sleon> from sun
[9:41] <sleon> looks like cache is 10 times more efficient then store
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[10:21] <_ph00> another guy (the thiord in a couple of days) reported that frost couldn't connect to freenet, tho freenet was up and nothing was using the freenet port. The first two times I heard of this was on winodows, nthis time it was on debian sid
[10:21] <_ph00> "the freenet port" = the frost port
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[12:37] <MineHaunter> "location" parameter in my ref is fluctuating of +/- 0.04 in the 24h
[12:37] <MineHaunter> is this ok?
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[12:53] <_ph00> "questioned, the dead man didn't answer..."
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[13:13] <toad_> MineHaunter: probably
[13:14] <toad_> MineHaunter: keep an eye on it
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[13:19] <ossa> was Theo on tv yesterday?
[13:19] <toad_> yes
[13:19] <toad_> on Newsnight
[13:20] <ossa> somebody youtube it?
[13:20] <toad_> it's on the beeb website until monday
[13:20] <toad_> 1sec
[13:20] <toad_> http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programmes/newsnight/default.stm
[13:21] <toad_> btw your email is broken
[13:21] <toad_> also if you have time i'd like to ask your opinion on the curious fact that the store is many many times less effective (hits per size) than the cache
[13:22] <ossa> no
[13:22] <ossa> it is working now
[13:23] <ossa> maybe because there are very few documents?
[13:23] <toad_> in which case i'd expect 100% success on CHKs
[13:23] <toad_> which we certainly don't get
[13:24] <ossa> maybe it doesn't work at all so it is all random?
[13:24] <toad_> maybe
[13:24] <toad_> the store does seem to be very specialized
[13:25] <toad_> the cache is a little bit specialized
[13:25] <ossa> to get an idea what is happening, you probably have to compare the real world data to controlled simulations
[13:25] <toad_> ossa: any way to test that theory?
[13:26] <toad_> ossa: how do you simulate storage? your simulations said cache sucks, but it all depends on the access distribution
[13:26] <ossa> yupp
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[13:26] <toad_> well mrogers is working on simulations
[13:27] <toad_> any numbers we should collect?
[13:27] <lhffan> gve sucks
[13:28] <toad_> there is some evidence of a close to 1/d distribution of link lengths
[13:28] <ossa> But I think a skewed distribution in document popularity should lead to the cache being hit more often...
[13:28] <ossa> toad_: That doesn't mean much.
[13:28] <toad_> ossa: hmm?
[13:29] <toad_> ossa: as a preliminary measure i propose to move from 80% store 20% cache to 50% store 50% cache, does this seem reasonable?
[13:29] <ossa> If the cache is being hit more I guess it makes sense.
[13:30] <toad_> so the cache being hit more doesn't necessarily indicate we have problems
[13:30] <ossa> I guess I could be simulating <<sigh>>
[13:30] <toad_> i suppose we need simulations with various different request distributions
[13:30] <toad_> ossa: well if you don't i'll wait for mrogers, but he's slow
[13:30] <ossa> Bad performance indicates problems.
[13:30] <toad_> he's far too thorough
[13:32] <ossa> I'll try
[13:32] <ossa> I am not at my most productive this time or year
[13:32] <toad_> this is useful of course as he simulates some of the low level stuff, and we can compare complex simulations to simple ones... thorough sims are useful, it's just that he's taking ages getting to the real meat (load balancing)
[13:32] <toad_> well, any help would be useful
[13:33] <toad_> is it really dark up your way?
[13:33] <ossa> I have an undergraduate working on a masters thesis who I am making simulate various identity swapping algorithms to see if something works better than completely random.
[13:33] <toad_> coool
[13:34] <ossa> well, cool if it works.
[13:34] <toad_> well yeah
[13:34] <toad_> if it doesn't work, do you still get a thesis? :)
[13:34] <toad_> only if you can show why, i suppose
[13:34] <ossa> CS masters thesi are jokes anyways.
[13:35] <ossa> For his thesis it will be enough if he can get a 10% convergence time increase or something.
[13:35] <ossa> Obviously for it to be useful, we are looking for an order difference.
[13:35] <toad_> what we need is O(n^2) to O(n)
[13:36] <toad_> or O(log^2) ideally
[13:36] <ossa> no
[13:36] <ossa> you can't go less than O(n)
[13:36] <toad_> i mean we already have O(n^2)
[13:36] <toad_> yeah doh
[13:36] <ossa> everybody has to switch at least once :-)
[13:36] <toad_> so that'd be at best something like O(n log^k n) for some k
[13:36] <ossa> well, any improvement is good
[13:37] <toad_> at the moment it looks like O(n^2), which is sorta manageable if swapping is faste enough but gets nasty for big or particularly dynamic networks
[13:39] <ossa> What was it you meant to send that didn't get through btw?
[13:39] <toad_> ossa: one minor thing I wanted to ask you about. at the moment we define "we are the sink" as "we have the closest key out of all of our connected neighbours (and ourself)". shouldn't that be we have the closest key out of all of the nodes we've actually sent the data to?
[13:40] <toad_> a node might be temporarily disconnected, it might be backed off etc
[13:40] <ossa> toad_: The first way is how I simulated it. There is no real math behind it, of course, so who knows.
[13:41] <ossa> But the point was to be able to have several sinks in the same path and they would all store the data.
[13:41] <toad_> well you run the risk of undercaching
[13:41] <ossa> or you run the risk of overcaching. Who knows.
[13:42] <toad_> well, in the simulation, there was no swapping during the request, and no backing off, and no disconnections
[13:42] <toad_> this means the two approaches should yield identical results normally
[13:42] <toad_> most of the time
[13:43] <toad_> since we route to nodes in order of their closeness to the target
[13:43] * toad_ thinks that's a Good Enough reason to do it the latter way
[13:44] <ossa> but we route depth first??
[13:44] <toad_> yes
[13:44] <ossa> so most people will only send it to one node?
[13:44] <toad_> so mostly it'll be just one node
[13:44] <toad_> but that doesn't matter because that one node was the optimal node
[13:44] <toad_> so then we cache iff we have a better location than that node
[13:45] <ossa> so what is the difference then?
[13:45] <toad_> in practice? disconnections and backoffs; nodes may come up which weren't up when we first routed it, and cause us to not cache the data
[13:46] <ossa> so another way of putting it is you want to discount nodes that are disconnected or backed off when deciding whether to store?
[13:47] <toad_> yes except we may route to backed off nodes if we have no other choice
[13:47] <toad_> backoff is advisory
[13:47] <toad_> but that's the principle of the matter yes
[13:48] <ossa> sounds like a good idea
[13:48] <toad_> ok cool
[13:48] <ossa> I mean, a node is a sink in practice, not in theory.
[13:48] <toad_> right
[13:49] <toad_> why is a 1/d link distribution meaningless btw?
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[13:49] <ossa> it seems a lot easier to establish something which looks like the correct distribution, then to get a routable network.
[13:50] <toad_> hmmm
[13:50] <ossa> The devil is in the deails (in particular, the connectivity over very short distances)
[13:50] <toad_> but if the metropolis-hastings algorithm does the former, it will do the latter too, won't it?
[13:50] <toad_> so networks typically fail because they have too few short links?
[13:53] <ossa> they fail because to few nodes with very similar IDs are right next to eachother
[13:56] <toad_> http://code.bulix.org/tt5ckw-21552
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[13:58] <ossa> that certainly looks good, but who knows
[13:59] <ossa> My experience is that the software isn't stable enough
[14:00] <toad_> in what sense?
[14:00] <ossa> Every time I've tried to start a node I've looked back a few days later, and it is down.
[14:00] <toad_> you mean it just exits/crashes?
[14:00] <toad_> did you use the installer
[14:00] <toad_> ?
[14:00] <ossa> exits with no log information to show why
[14:00] <toad_> just running the jar is bad, it will crash, and it won't be able to recover
[14:00] <toad_> because of bugs in the JVM
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[14:01] <toad_> if you DID use the installer, then post your wrapper.log to me, that will normally include info on why it crashed
[14:01] <ossa> The bugs never used to be that bad
[14:01] <toad_> not our fault, and we do work around it reasonably successfully
[14:02] <ossa> by letting it crash every few hours and restarting?
[14:02] <toad_> it usually runs for a few days
[14:03] <toad_> if it's crashing every few hours then you've got bigger problems - low memory settings perhaps
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[14:03] <toad_> actually the eviljvmbug is quite rare now...
[14:03] <ossa> what is it?
[14:03] <toad_> a deadlock in the JVM relating to threading
[14:04] <toad_> the JVM jams up, many threads waiting for a lock which isn't held by any thread
[14:04] <toad_> there is a bug for it on sun's website
[14:05] <toad_> it said make sure you don't have daemon and non-daemon threads using the same lock; we did that
[14:05] <toad_> we still get it sometimes though i believe
[14:06] <ossa> ok. I'm just saying that when I tried to run a node it just kept crashing.
[14:06] <toad_> if you install it using the installer, (or even unpack the tarball), it should work okay
[14:06] <toad_> did you just run the jars?
[14:06] <ossa> probably
[14:07] <ossa> I don't like the complications
[14:07] <toad_> well try the installer next time ... or unpack the tarfile from http://downloads.freenetproject.org/alpha/installer/freenet07.tar.gz
[14:08] <toad_> if you want to hack on it you have to set the classpath, but you can still use the wrapper (I do); set wrapper.java.classpath.*
[14:08] <toad_> brb
[14:09] <toad_> (in wrapper.conf)
[14:12] <howdoiuseit> what does it means : Current activity
[14:13] <howdoiuseit> hi
[14:13] <ossa> that newsnite thing didn't include theo
[14:13] <toad_> howdoiuseit: just some statistics
[14:13] <toad_> ossa: they interviewed him for about 30 seconds
[14:13] <toad_> the newsnight titles at the beginning show an email i wrote to theo
[14:14] <toad_> if that is not the case then you may have the wrong newsnight
[14:14] <howdoiuseit> thank you
[14:14] <ossa> yeah, I got the podcast, it obviously wasn't the same thing
[14:14] <toad_> ah
[14:14] <toad_> get the video
[14:14] <toad_> we're close to the beginning
[14:14] <toad_> very close
[14:14] <ossa> haha
[14:15] <ossa> the stream is tiny
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[14:15] <schmorp_> hi!
[14:15] <schmorp_> can anybody tell me how to gte rid of a bogus ip in my noderef? using "bind to ip" has little effect, inclode local addresses is false
[14:15] <toad_> hi
[14:15] <toad_> bogus ip?
[14:15] <schmorp_> physical.udp=129.13.162.95:5061;129.13.162.92:5061
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[14:16] <_ph00> heh
[14:16] <_ph00> that auto-kciking thingy
[14:16] <_ph00> is it set to kick out people on any ref-like line?
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[14:16] <schmorp_> now it worked
[14:16] <toad_> _ph00: only on that one
[14:16] <_ph00> did you get the unwanted IP off?
[14:16] <schmorp_> physical.udp=129.13.162.95:5061;129.13.162.92:5061 is what i have
[14:16] <toad_> schmorp_: huh?
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[14:17] <schmorp_> gosh is this broken
[14:17] <_ph00> toad_, he wanted to have a ref where only one of his two connections showed up
[14:17] <toad_> okay
[14:17] <schmorp_> yes
[14:17] <toad_> so you have two ip addresses in your noderef instead of one
[14:17] <_ph00> shmorp, when you send the IP, take away "physycal udp" or you get kicked off
[14:17] <schmorp_> yes
[14:17] <toad_> that's the basic problem?
[14:18] <schmorp_> yes
[14:18] <schmorp_> i have two addresses, need to have one
[14:18] <schmorp_> i can probably temporarily get rid of it by removing the ip address form my interface
[14:18] <toad_> are you behind a router?
[14:18] <_ph00> did you do that disconnect thing?
[14:18] <schmorp_> no, directly connected
[14:18] <toad_> did your ip address change recently?
[14:18] <schmorp_> _ph00: that would probbaly not do good to the connections running on the "wrong" ip address
[14:18] <toad_> it's getting the extra address from somewhere
[14:18] <schmorp_> toad_: no, the host has 4 ip addresses
[14:19] <toad_> ah
[14:19] <toad_> i see
[14:19] <_ph00> he's a big university afaiu
[14:19] <toad_> you only want it to report one
[14:19] <ossa> 4?
[14:19] <_ph00> AT a
[14:19] <schmorp_> the ones it uses are the first two on the interface
[14:19] <toad_> do you also want it only to bind to one?
[14:19] <schmorp_> toad_: yes
[14:19] <schmorp_> toad_: binding doesn't matter much, either way would be fine
[14:19] <toad_> go to Configuration, find "advanced darknet" and set it to true
[14:19] <toad_> that enables expert settings
[14:19] <schmorp_> toad_: i do nmake sure the bulk of the load is on one adrdess, however
[14:19] <schmorp_> set to true
[14:19] <toad_> okay click apply
[14:20] <schmorp_> done
[14:20] <toad_> now find node.bindTo, set that to the ip address you want to bind to
[14:20] <schmorp_> oh, i ste it to 129.13.162.95 earleir
[14:20] <toad_> you can include a list of ip's with commas or you can leave it alone
[14:20] <schmorp_> the only effetc i had is that .95 is now listed first, .92 now second
[14:20] <toad_> now find node.ipAddressOverride and set it to your ip address
[14:21] <toad_> did you already do that?
[14:21] <schmorp_> oh wait, i said somethign wrong
[14:21] <schmorp_> i only usesd the override setting
[14:21] <toad_> hmmm
[14:21] <toad_> well
[14:21] <schmorp_> no effect if i ste both to the right adrdess, though
[14:21] <toad_> maybe we should turn off ip autodetection if somebody has set a bindTo
[14:21] <schmorp_> the wrong one is still in my noderefs
[14:22] <toad_> and if that bindTo checks out as a real internet address
[14:22] <schmorp_> yeah, programs that insist on knowing better are evil :)
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[14:22] <toad_> okay...
[14:22] <schmorp_> so it seems i have to wait till i can temporarily disable the other address
[14:22] <CIA-14> toad * r10718 /trunk/freenet/src/freenet/node/GlobalProbe.java: Don't keep probing at 1.0.
[14:22] <schmorp_> ok, thanks for the try anyways
[14:22] <toad_> i insist on keeping autodetection if ipAddressOverride is set though
[14:22] <toad_> schmorp_: wait
[14:22] <toad_> schmorp_: i can give you a jar to test...
[14:22] <schmorp_> i am here
[14:22] <schmorp_> sure
[14:24] * ferrox (i=ferrox@) has joined #freenet
[14:28] <_ph00> hehe
[14:28] <_ph00> nice hostname...
[14:32] * Lu{ifer is now known as KerryKing
[14:33] * KerryKing is now known as Lu{ifer
[14:36] <CIA-14> toad * r10719 /trunk/freenet/src/freenet/ (io/comm/UdpSocketManager.java node/NodeIPDetector.java): Don't do auto-detection if a valid bind-to address is set.
[14:36] <toad_> schmorp_: when the bot says it's been built, get 10719 from http://downloads.freenetproject.org/alpha/
[14:37] <toad_> schmorp_: shut down your node, replace freenet.jar with the jar from there, and start it back up
[14:37] <toad_> freenet-stable-latest.jar i mean
[14:37] <toad_> check that it's actually running 10719 when it starts up (it's listed on the front page)
[14:37] <toad_> schmorp_: then please verify that it fixes your problem, then tell me
[14:37] <howdoiuseit> seems that i'm trying to connect to 82.103.65.172:56353 udp6 'java (2764)' Bulgarian National Bank via freenet, is it possible, if so, do you suggest me to allow this connection?
[14:38] <schmorp_> o my way
[14:38] <schmorp_> on, even
[14:38] <toad_> howdoiuseit: did you recently add a node reference with that ip address?
[14:40] * MaxxDrv (n=mack@) has joined #freenet
[14:40] <howdoiuseit> yes i guess
[14:40] * JustMe (i=JustMe_@) has joined #freenet
[14:41] <schmorp_> toad_: not quite: physical.udp=129.13.162.95:5061;0.0.0.0:5061
[14:41] * schmorp_ was kicked from #freenet by FreenetLogBot
[14:41] * schmorp_ (i=schmorp@) has joined #freenet
[14:41] <schmorp_> sorry
[14:42] <toad_> schmorp_: are you sure you set node.bindTo ?
[14:42] <howdoiuseit> or i've added someone with another ip that was referencing a peer with that ip...
[14:42] <schmorp_> toad_: i'll make a screenshot
[14:42] <schmorp_> toad_: yes, i am certain i did set it
[14:42] <schmorp_> toad_: but its reset to 0.0.0.0
[14:42] <CIA-14> toad * r10720 /trunk/freenet/src/freenet/node/NodeIPDetector.java: D'oh!
[14:42] <schmorp_> toad_: isn't the stetings persistent?
[14:42] <toad_> schmorp_: it can't be changed on the fly
[14:43] <schmorp_> bindTo freenet.config.InvalidConfigValueException: Cannot be updated on the fly
[14:43] <schmorp_> ah
[14:43] <toad_> schmorp_: you need to shut down the node and then change it in freenet.ini
[14:43] <schmorp_> node.bindTo=129.13.162.95
[14:43] <schmorp_> node.ipAddressOverride=129.13.162.95
[14:43] <schmorp_> but
[14:44] <schmorp_> ...dp=129.13.162.95:5061;129.13.162.92:5061
[14:44] <schmorp_> Freenet 0.7 Build #991 r10719
[14:45] <schmorp_> the udp line i pasted before was with bindTo=0.0.0.0, obviously
[14:46] <schmorp_> udp=129.13.162.95:5061;129.13.162.95:5061
[14:46] <schmorp_> (r10720)
[14:46] <schmorp_> good enough for me
[14:47] <schmorp_> *splendid*, actually :=)
[14:47] <toad_> hmmm wait
[14:47] <schmorp_> sure
[14:48] <CIA-14> toad * r10721 /trunk/freenet/src/freenet/node/NodeIPDetector.java: Don't add if already there from overrideIPAddress.
[14:50] <toad_> schmorp_: 10721?
[14:50] <schmorp_> so far, 404 not found
[14:50] <schmorp_> but it took a while with .19, too
[14:50] <toad_> right, it's not built yet
[14:51] <toad_> wait for the bot to say it's built
[14:51] <schmorp_> hehe
[14:51] <schmorp_> even then it took a few minutes with ..19
[14:51] <CIA-14> toad * r10722 /trunk/freenet/src/freenet/node/NodeIPDetector.java: Trivial tidy-up
[14:51] * howdoiuseit (n=kvirc@) Quit ("KVIrc 3.2.0 'Realia'")
[14:53] <schmorp_> wow, it crashed :)
[14:54] <schmorp_> (r..20)
[14:54] <toad_> it what?
[14:54] <schmorp_> my node is gone
[14:54] <toad_> what happened?
[14:54] <schmorp_> where do i have to look?
[14:54] <toad_> you installed via the installer?
[14:55] <schmorp_> yes, but i had to do it on a different machine and it took quite some hackery
[14:55] <schmorp_> it does use the wrapper, thoguh, if you mean that
[14:55] <toad_> ok
[14:55] <toad_> post wrapper.log to code.bulix.org and show the url
[14:56] <schmorp_> http://txt.schmorp.de/ac830d3899198dc7d397e7ef6ce30851.txt
[14:56] <toad_> hmmm
[14:56] <toad_> that's not good
[14:56] <toad_> that's a jvm crash
[14:56] <toad_> just restart it, it should go away
[14:56] <schmorp_> thats very common with 0.5, too
[14:57] <toad_> "very common" ?
[14:57] <schmorp_> in fact, i use this 1.4 version because it proved to be much mroe stable than later versions
[14:57] <toad_> you have some wierd system?
[14:57] <schmorp_> yes
[14:57] <schmorp_> no
[14:57] <schmorp_> pretty sdtandard debian
[14:57] <schmorp_> 64 bit, thoguh
[14:57] <toad_> you have hardwareproblems?
[14:57] <toad_> hmmm
[14:57] <schmorp_> but i never got freenet stable with 64 bit
[14:57] <toad_> it's stable here
[14:57] <toad_> etch on 64-bit with sun java
[14:57] <schmorp_> unlikely, the server runs lots of other stuff using lots of cpu and those services don't suffer form problems
[14:57] <toad_> amd64 or intel?
[14:58] <toad_> etch or sarge or sid?
[14:58] <schmorp_> amd64
[14:58] <schmorp_> a mix
[14:58] <toad_> hmmm
[14:58] <schmorp_> i run it in a mostly-testing 32 bit env
[14:58] <toad_> well all i can say is it works here
[14:58] <toad_> on pure etch amd64
[14:58] <schmorp_> well, the problem moves with freenet, not the machine
[14:58] <schmorp_> i am running freenet for a long time
[14:58] <toad_> well, it plainly isn't with freenet
[14:58] <schmorp_> and it extreemly depends on which sun java vm it uses
[14:58] <toad_> nothing an app does should cause the jvm to crash
[14:59] <schmorp_> yes, i doubt very much it ever had anthing to do with freenet
[14:59] <toad_> exit sure but crash is bad
[14:59] <schmorp_> freenet might be buggy as hell - the jvm must not crash nevertheless
[14:59] <toad_> so suggest you try again
[14:59] <schmorp_> yeah, i am used to that
[14:59] <schmorp_> maybe i could use a newre jvm with 0.7
[14:59] <schmorp_> anyways
[14:59] <schmorp_> r..22
[14:59] <sandos> ossa, nodeUptime: 2w3d: my node is apparently stable as a rock ;)
[15:00] <sandos> never had any problems with 0.7, really...
[15:00] <schmorp_> =129.13.162.95:5061;129.13.162.95:5061;129.13.162.95:5061
[15:00] <schmorp_> sandos: wonderful :)
[15:00] <sandos> yeah =)
[15:00] <schmorp_> sandos: i must say 0.7 was by far the most horrific experience in installing
[15:00] <sandos> really?
[15:00] <schmorp_> sandos: yes - graphicall installer is completely unusable over a 1mbit link
[15:00] <sandos> aha
[15:00] <schmorp_> sandos: (while i cna run other x apps fine with much less)
[15:01] <sandos> weird
[15:01] <schmorp_> sandos: non-graphical installer says it cannot download
[15:01] <schmorp_> sandos: without giving me any hint on why
[15:01] <schmorp_> sandos: manual install as per the wiki doesn't work
[15:01] <toad_> well you could use the tarball
[15:01] <toad_> you tried the tarball?
[15:01] <schmorp_> (and the wiki is annoying too - you can't double-click and paste)
[15:01] <toad_> double click and paste?
[15:01] <schmorp_> toad_: if that refers to the manual install, i tried to use the tarball
[15:01] <toad_> that sounds like a web browser problem
[15:01] <schmorp_> toad_: but it wasn't there
[15:01] <toad_> not a problem with the site
[15:01] <schmorp_> toad_: only on the wiki pages?
[15:02] <toad_> http://downloads.freenetproject.org/alpha/installer/freenet07.tar.gz
[15:02] <toad_> there it is
[15:02] <schmorp_> toad_: i can double-click anywhere i want and it selects... something
[15:02] <sandos> networkSizeEstimateSession: 1269 nodes
[15:02] <schmorp_> toad_: on the freenet wiki it links to a nonexistant page
[15:02] <toad_> schmorp_: doesn't make any sense to me
[15:02] <schmorp_> toad_: well, i got it working finally by installing it at home, then copying
[15:02] <schmorp_> toad_: wait
[15:02] <toad_> sandos: nice
[15:02] <sandos> I wonder how many of my locations are "bogus": people reinstalling or deleting their nodefiles or whatever
[15:02] <schmorp_> http://wiki.freenetproject.org/FreenetInstallationLinux
[15:03] <sandos> hopefully not too many
[15:03] <schmorp_> double clicking there on _any_ word (Such as "Start") brings me to http://wiki.freenetproject.org/FreenetInstallationLinux/edit
[15:03] <schmorp_> the illegal characters on that page forced me to paste line by line (which i would have preferred to do anyways)
[15:03] <schmorp_> and the double-click thing forced me to manually select lines
[15:04] <toad_> hmmm
[15:04] <schmorp_> <div class="page" ondblclick="document.location='http://wiki.freenetproject.org/FreenetInstallationLinux/edit';"
[15:04] <toad_> i have no idea what's going on there
[15:04] <schmorp_> wow, didn't know that works
[15:04] <schmorp_> well
[15:04] <toad_> well
[15:04] <toad_> what's the problem?
[15:04] <schmorp_> i won't go into the merits of problems of using javascript to do "fun stuff" :)
[15:05] <toad_> you want to be able to select a line at once with doubleclick?
[15:05] <schmorp_> toad_: the problem is that it forces me to select lines in a very tedious way
[15:05] <toad_> we don't want to have to maintain a fork of the wiki
[15:05] <schmorp_> toad_: i don't suggets you should
[15:05] <toad_> it might be configurable
[15:05] <toad_> anyway
[15:05] <schmorp_> but all that made it an unpleasent experience to install - took me much longer than 0.5
[15:05] <toad_> ANY and ALL complaints you have should be either a) filed as bugs on https://bugs.freenetproject.org/ or b) posted to the lists (support@freenetproject.org)
[15:06] <schmorp_> of course
[15:06] <toad_> and if you don't like javascript turn it off
[15:07] <schmorp_> oh, i like javascript very much
[15:07] <schmorp_> you can do useful stuff with it :)
[15:07] <schmorp_> i'll stay if you want me to test further
[15:07] <schmorp_> personally, i don't care if i have the same ip two or three times on my noderef
[15:08] <toad_> schmorp_: if you could test that last build that would be helpful
[15:08] <schmorp_> 22?
[15:08] <schmorp_> already tested, see above, gives me udp=129.13.162.95:5061;129.13.162.95:5061;129.13.162.95:5061
[15:08] <toad_> 21
[15:08] <toad_> 22 is trivial
[15:08] <schmorp_> shall i go back?
[15:09] <toad_> i don't understand how it could produce three of them
[15:10] <toad_> they're all correct?
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[15:10] <schmorp_> afaics, they are three times the same address
[15:10] <CIA-14> jflesch * r10723 /trunk/apps/Thaw/src/thaw/core/PluginManager.java: Fix NPE
[15:10] <schmorp_> yes, unless i am blind
[15:11] <schmorp_> (which happened before :)
[15:11] <toad_> if you restart without changing the build, does it produce 4 of them?
[15:11] <toad_> yes, they are all the same
[15:11] <schmorp_> toad_: stays at three
[15:11] <schmorp_> anmd bindto and override are both 129.13.162.95 in my .ini
[15:12] <toad_> okay, test #23
[15:12] <toad_> when it gets there
[15:12] <CIA-14> toad * r10724 /trunk/freenet/src/freenet/node/NodeIPDetector.java: I'm an idiot.
[15:12] <schmorp_> #24 maybe?
[15:12] <toad_> 24 yes
[15:15] <schmorp_> udp=129.13.162.95:5061;129.13.162.95:5061 (#24)
[15:20] * mozillaman (n=borg@) Quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
[15:20] * mozillaman_ (n=borg@) Quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
[15:21] <toad_> schmorp_: :(
[15:22] <schmorp_> really, its a minor thing. i wouldn't let it go through i my own programs, of course.
[15:22] <schmorp_> :)
[15:23] <CIA-14> toad * r10725 /trunk/freenet/src/freenet/node/NodeIPDetector.java: I am truly an idiot.
[15:23] <toad_> please try 25 :)
[15:25] * new061128 (n=chatzill@) Quit ("Chatzilla 0.9.75 [Firefox 1.5.0.7/2006090918]")
[15:26] <toad_> 26 locations up to 0.05137504921161451
[15:26] <toad_> => estimate total 500 nodes
[15:27] <schmorp_> it is such a thing of beauty!
[15:27] <schmorp_> udp=129.13.162.95:5061
[15:27] <schmorp_> thanks for the wonderful support :)
[15:28] <toad_> :)
[15:29] * PraiseChaos (n=kcecil@) Quit (Remote closed the connection)
[15:29] <schmorp_> cu, have fun!
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[16:00] * ChanServ sets mode +o Bombe
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[16:01] <schmorp> it seems it crashes everytime after this message: Failed to load native FEC: java.lang.ExceptionInInitializerError
[16:01] <toad_> bizarre
[16:01] <schmorp> http://txt.schmorp.de/3eee75ee757421dd488877b79111a3f2.txt
[16:01] <toad_> i doubt very much that the crash has anything to do with that, everyone gets that
[16:02] <schmorp> ah ok
[16:02] <schmorp> ignore me
[16:02] <schmorp> at the positive side, it is indeed crashin and restarting
[16:03] <schmorp> much better than 05. behaviour oftentimes: 100% cpu, no crash, no restart :)
[16:03] <toad_> how frequently does it crash?
[16:03] <toad_> :)
[16:03] <schmorp> well, i am running it for 3 hours now
[16:03] <schmorp> a bit early to say
[16:03] <toad_> it's been up for 3 hours without crashing?
[16:03] <schmorp> do you think i should move to a newer jvm?
[16:03] <toad_> how many times has it crahsed in that time?
[16:03] <schmorp> no, its been up for ~30 mins without crashing
[16:03] <toad_> a 1.5 JVM is a good idea yes
[16:03] <schmorp> any docs and how to get the wrapper to use 1.5 (its already installed)?
[16:04] <toad_> just install it
[16:04] <schmorp> it is installed
[16:04] <toad_> the wrapper will use whatever is on the path
[16:04] <schmorp> hmm, ok
[16:04] <schmorp> thx a lot
[16:04] <toad_> change the path to point to 1.5 instead of 1.4
[16:04] <toad_> path and JAVA_HOME
[16:05] <CIA-14> toad * r10726 /trunk/freenet/src/freenet/node/GlobalProbe.java: Show estimated network size.
[16:07] <schmorp> can i see anywhere what jvm version it runs under? tried the web interface and wrapper.log
[16:07] <schmorp> (not that i suggets it should be shown)
[16:08] <toad_> java -version
[16:08] <toad_> :)
[16:08] <toad_> it's also logged somewhere
[16:08] <schmorp> that... doesn'tr quite show the version of java freenet uses :)
[16:08] <schmorp> lsof solved it
[16:08] <toad_> it doesn't?
[16:09] <schmorp> well, the point of double-checking is to see wether thw wrapper corretcly used my PATH
[16:09] <schmorp> splendid
[16:09] <schmorp> now running with 1.5
[16:09] <schmorp> 0.5 only survived a few hours with 1.5
[16:10] <schmorp> and 0.5 and 0.7 seem to run just fine alongside each other
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[16:25] <toad_> they should as long as the ports don't clash ... the installer will prevent that, but not if it's run on a different machine
[16:28] <schmorp> thats one of the few things i actually managed to work on my own (with help form the wiki, of course :)
[16:30] * PraiseChaos (n=kcecil@) Quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
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[16:34] <Tuna> hi!
[16:34] <Tuna> nice seeing Toad back and making commits like crazy
[16:35] <Tuna> been watching mrRogers commiting changes since the beginning of the summer,
[16:35] <Tuna> Im curious about any findings he/you might have made during the tests..
[16:35] * schmorp (i=schmorp@) has left #freenet
[16:36] <Tuna> havent really seen any results even though I know they're on their way
[17:21] <Jflesch> toad_: I think I've found a bug in freenet.node.fcp.ClientGet
[17:22] <Jflesch> toad_: when I send a GetRequestStatus (OnlyData=True), sendPendingMessages is called
[17:22] <Jflesch> bt
[17:22] <Jflesch> s/bt/but
[17:22] <Jflesch> allDataPending is == null
[17:22] <Jflesch> it happens when I try to fetch a file who was completed before the node start
[17:22] <Jflesch> s/who/which/
[17:23] <Jflesch> toad_: it looks like ClientGetter doesn't call ClientGet.onSuccess() to set allDataPending value
[17:24] <Jflesch> toad_: so I tried to force a call ClientGetter.restart (the third constructor is called in my situation), and force onSuccess to accept a call even if succeeded is set to true
[17:25] <Jflesch> and then it worked
[17:25] <Jflesch> s/third constructor/third constructor of ClientGet/
[17:25] <Jflesch> (I don't know if I'm really clear in fact ..... :)
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[17:26] * mazzanet (n=mazzanet@) Quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
[17:26] <Jflesch> toad_: the main problem now for me is that I don't know how to solve it "nicely"
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[17:37] <schmorp> is crashing due to "out of memory" a common thing? do i need to give my node more memory?
[17:38] <Jflesch> schmorp: If you often have "out of memory", I think you should
[17:38] <Jflesch> schmorp: you can by modifying the wrapper.conf
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[17:38] <schmorp> wel, i am running a basically idle node, and have trouble getting uptimes >>1h
[17:38] <Jflesch> (wrapper.java.maxmemory)
[17:39] <Jflesch> schmorp: hm, strange
[17:39] <Jflesch> schmorp: how many peers have you ?
[17:39] <schmorp> i'll give it more memory and will see, thanks a lot for the pointer
[17:39] <schmorp> 15
[17:39] <Jflesch> you're welcome :)
[17:39] <Jflesch> and you've out of memory erros ? hmm, weird
[17:39] <schmorp> Exception in thread "Decoder for freenet.client.async.SplitFileFetcherSegment@1bae443" java.lang.OutOfMemoryError: unable to create new native thread
[17:40] <schmorp> well, i am used to by 0.5 node to need ~800mb ram
[17:40] <schmorp> but that node is really overloaded
[17:42] <schmorp> Could not reserve enough space for object heap
[17:42] <schmorp> thats when i tell it to use 512M
[17:42] <schmorp> (for wrapper.java.maxmemory)
[17:42] <Jflesch> schmorp: try first with 256MB maybe ?
[17:43] <Jflesch> 512 seems a little bit high I think
[17:43] <schmorp> is there a hard limit i surpass with 512M?
[17:43] <schmorp> the machine has 1.5GB free ram
[17:43] <schmorp> i'll try 256 now
[17:43] <schmorp> same thing
[17:43] <Jflesch> for my part, my node is set on 512, but I'm a little bit violent
[17:43] <Jflesch> (for example sometimes I refresh all the frost boards at once ...)
[17:44] <Jflesch> (or I use thaw to download 50 files at the same time ... etc)
[17:44] <schmorp> on my 0.5 node i usually have 400 fcp conenctions
[17:44] <schmorp> now i get java.lang.OutOfMemoryError: unable to create new native thread
[17:44] <schmorp> almost diretcly after startup
[17:45] <schmorp> (maxmemory 256)
[17:45] <schmorp> could it be a red herring and itsa not rreally ram, but number of threads or something?
[17:45] <Jflesch> I don't know :/
[17:45] <schmorp> well, thats fine :)
[17:45] <Jflesch> for my part, most of the time it worked well with 256
[17:46] <schmorp> well, i don'T *use* it for anything yte, so i would expect it to use much less
[17:46] <Jflesch> schmorp: yes, it's really really weird
[17:46] <schmorp> java is testing me, as usual
[17:47] <Jflesch> schmorp: what OS and what Jvm do you use ?
[17:47] <schmorp> gnu/linux and jdk1.5.0_07
[17:47] <Jflesch> hmm, should work without any problem :/
[17:47] <schmorp> in 32 bit mode
[17:50] <_ph00> I have my freenet max memory set to 512, on a 1GB RAM machine, and works fine
[17:50] <schmorp> i know, its always me having problems: java obviously hates me
[17:51] <_ph00> maybe because you hte java?
[17:51] <_ph00> a
[17:51] <schmorp> no, i cna disprove that
[17:51] <schmorp> i liked ajva
[17:52] <schmorp> i was one of the first buyers of java in a nutshell in 1995 or so
[17:52] <schmorp> :)
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[17:56] <sandos> schmorp, haha java ina nutshell, the book?
[17:56] <schmorp> yes, o'reilly
[17:56] <sandos> I saw one of those the other day.. when moving a taken-over companys belgongings
[17:56] <schmorp> or maybe i got the title wrong
[17:56] <sandos> I didnt take it though. too old ;)
[17:57] <schmorp> java in a nutshell, february 1996
[17:57] <schmorp> well, it still crashes my browser often, so i don't see much has changed *g*
[17:58] <schmorp> but of course, back then, it was even slower
[17:58] <schmorp> compiler technology became very impressive
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[18:54] <Jflesch> toad_: https://bugs.freenetproject.org/view.php?id=651
[18:57] <Jflesch> I updated this bug report according to what I said before
[19:01] <schmorp> my node seems to work now, with jdk 1.5 and 384M of ram, btw.
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[19:14] <investigator> Freenet doesn't seem to be working today. Is there some kind of problem?
[19:15] <investigator> oops, working now
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[19:59] <valleygreen22> how do I register my nick?
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[20:04] <Yinx> anyone want to exchange refs? here is ine http://dark-code.bulix.org/y24bkl-19101?raw
[20:06] <morningwood> use the #freenet-refs channel
[20:06] <Yinx> sorry i guess i should pay attention to what room i am in...thanks
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[20:36] <CIA-14> bback * r10727 /trunk/freenet/src/freenet/clients/http/StatisticsToadlet.java: added overallSize percent to statistics
[20:39] <CIA-14> bback * r10728 /trunk/freenet/src/freenet/clients/http/StatisticsToadlet.java: corrected statistics output
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[20:51] <Pizzi> Hi I am a freenet first-timer. Would anyone share their reference with me, allowring me to connect to the network?
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[21:23] <_ph00> guys I have to quit this nickname, before they ban me
[21:23] <_ph00> I'll be back using tor, with another nick, hope some of you will recognize me
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[21:32] <MineHaunter> what happened ^ph00?
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[21:51] <Line0line> hey guys, is there a way for me to run a spider in windows ?
[21:52] <MineHaunter> spiders can't run on windows
[21:52] <MineHaunter> the glass is too smooth
[21:52] <MineHaunter> :P
[21:52] <TheSeeker> If the window is a skylight...
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[21:53] <Line0line> arf
[21:53] <Line0line> ;)
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[21:54] <Line0line> oh well... maybe a regular spider will do, i mean, its just software capturing links and opening them and so on right ?
[21:54] <MineHaunter> yep
[21:55] <Line0line> i dont need a piece of software designed specially for freenet i guess
[21:55] <MineHaunter> well... a freenet-specific spider is better because freenet is very peculiar
[21:55] <MineHaunter> but a generic spider may work as well
[21:56] <Line0line> hmmm
[21:56] <Line0line> i wish i could make my own
[21:56] <Line0line> ^^;;
[21:58] <Line0line> hmmmmm.. wait
[21:58] <Line0line> what if i launch wget on a link
[21:58] <Line0line> save the file
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[21:58] <Line0line> parse it for links
[21:59] <Line0line> launch wget for each of those
[21:59] <Line0line> and so on ?
[21:59] <MineHaunter> it could work
[21:59] <Line0line> heh thnx for supporting me :D
[22:00] <MineHaunter> keep an eye on errors tho
[22:00] <MineHaunter> freenet has different errors from plain http
[22:01] <MineHaunter> eg. a "data not found" error may or may not be permanent, you should retry at a later time for n times
[22:01] <Line0line> hmmm right !
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[22:26] <nextgens> Line0line> check the wiki ... there is a spider plugin
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[22:50] <nextgens> bbl
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[23:07] <CIA-14> jflesch * r10729 /trunk/apps/Thaw/src/thaw/plugins/index/Index.java: Start directly index downloading without passing by the queue
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[23:38] <nextgens> sanity> I've replied to your mail
[23:38] <nextgens> sanity> such AV softwares shouldn't even exist
[23:39] <karr^> ?
Irc logs of #freenet : 2008 2007 2006 2005
These logs were automatically created by FreenetLogBot on chat.freenode.net using the Java IRC LogBot.