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[1:54] <_ph00> man this is great
[1:54] <_ph00> I just found all the asterix stories on freenet
[1:55] <_ph00> (in french, of course, which is the way they should be read)
[1:55] <_ph00> I don't know much french... but I already know the stories, so...
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[2:13] <troythered> in my configuration, under store size in bytes, i can change it from 1G to say, 10G for freenet stuff right?
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[2:20] <_ph00> yes
[2:20] <troythered> sweet thx
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[7:36] <automagic> java.lang.ClassNotFoundException: com.birosoft.liquid.LiquidLookAndFeel
[7:36] <automagic> why????
[7:37] <TheSeeker> You're having a problem with Frost?
[7:38] <automagic> the new_installer.jar
[7:40] <automagic> oh damnit, you really do need to use Sun's java...
[7:40] <automagic> nevermind
[7:43] <automagic> what are STUN and Librarian? my installer couldnt find them
[7:49] <TheSeeker> plugins
[7:50] <TheSeeker> stun does UDP hole punching if you need it, and Librarian is a spider, I think. Creates a searchable index
[7:51] <TheSeeker> wait, no, librarian is just the thing that searches indexes... the index is made by 'the definitive spider'
[7:51] <automagic> "Enabling the STUN plugin" times out during my installation
[7:52] <automagic> it can't find plugins/JSTUN.jar.url
[7:52] <automagic> same w librarian
[7:52] <TheSeeker> well, your node probably isn't up then.
[7:53] <automagic> this is during the installer
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[9:19] <nextgens> agsarite> I'm back
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[14:09] <jaceks> hello
[14:09] <jaceks> can someone help me? i am new at freenet
[14:09] <jaceks> i got a questions:
[14:09] <jaceks> how can i search files etc?
[14:10] <jaceks> and other ask: i added 5 *.avi files to upload and my load average get mad, my cpu is heavy loaded, what's going on?
[14:11] <nextgens> it's probably fec-encoding them
[14:11] <nextgens> the cpu usage will return to normal when it's done
[14:13] <jaceks> what is fec-encoding? is it like md5sum? or ed2k_hash?
[14:13] <nextgens> it's not a one way hashing function
[14:14] <nextgens> it's to create redundancy blocks
[14:14] <nextgens> FEC stands for forward error correction iirc
[14:15] <jaceks> i have athlon thunderbird 1.33/512mb, i added 5 *.avi, 350mb each, how long should it take?
[14:15] <jaceks> is possible to see progres of this operation?
[14:16] <nextgens> I dunno - no
[14:16] <nextgens> it shouldn't take more that a few mins
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[16:33] <sbc> When running freemail I get this http://pastebin.ca/213754 . Anything to worry about? (Freemail seems to keep running.)
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[20:47] <sanity> has toad resurfaced yet?
[20:47] <nextgens> no
[20:47] <nextgens> not here at least
[20:48] <nextgens> his node has been down for a few hours today
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[21:12] <David57> hi folks !
[21:13] <David57> can I ask a question about thaw ?
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[21:37] <nextgens> David57> don't ask to ask, just ask
[21:42] <David57> nextgens: when I download files using thaw, they never finish (99% in thaw), although the files are finished (downloaded in temp, in the freenet web interface)
[21:44] <nextgens> David57> what version of thaw are you using ?
[21:44] <nextgens> have you tried updating it ?
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[21:55] <David57> nextgens: CHK@bkq9p0XFY9RFyzdnq5vgaMdSbaYsIdqhmhOJOabWjsE,LCtUjmsAUmmXGb6IYuydy~f7sNfOmFw0qCaYNZWWLDk,AAEAAAA/pbear.jpg
[21:56] <David57> oops
[21:56] <David57> lol
[21:56] <David57> I meant : [ INFO ] thaw.core.Core: Thaw, version 0.6 WIP r10657
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[22:06] <nextgens> I suggest you update
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[22:10] <nextgens> http://downloads.freenetproject.org/alpha/Thaw/Thaw.jar
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[22:23] <Rleyh> is is fnp port number the only port freenet needs to be forwarded?
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[22:35] <Johiel> Why even though I have 4 nodes connected does a search not work?
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[22:35] <Johiel> I get the same error message all the time invalid key
[22:35] <Johiel> Do the nodes Im searching just not have any files?
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[22:43] <Rley1> is fnp port number the only port freenet needs to be forwarded? im still getting a message that im behind a NAT
[22:43] <Johiel> I get that but Im connectd to 4 nodes
[22:43] <Johiel> but not able to search
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[22:47] <investigator> There's something I'm not sure about. I asked someone about peers probing my data store, and got this answer: "Your neighbors can probe your store for specific content by using a hacked node to send requests for all parts of a file to your node, and timing how long it takes to get a response. For stuff you have, all parts will be returned quickly at a uniform rate. For things you don't have, some parts will take a lot longe
[22:48] <investigator> It occurred to me that using the same reasoning, if one of my peers requested a file, and was connected only to me (either by design or by happenstance) the result could be the same, that all parts of the file could come through my node, even if I've never seen the file. That could make it look like I requested the file, when I didn't. Is that possible?
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[23:09] <skyye> !chk
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[23:21] <grongbong> Hi guys, I wonder if anyone using freenet actually is using it "Darknet style", their nodes conecting only to those of their friends. I assume that maybe this is true around the developers of freenet?
[23:23] <grongbong> I would like to go this route, for the fun and experiment, and have been pitching freenet to some of my friends. Of course, what we'll create for a start is our own freenet network.
[23:24] <grongbong> The theory behind freenet is that, over time this small network would conect to other small networks, and eventually get us all into a world wide darknet.
[23:24] <skyye> !cc
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[23:27] <grongbong> So, while I go and experiment with this very improbably experiment of mine :), I would like to sugest freenet developers to make freenet as easy as pie, as easy as, for example, registering and using Myspace, or hi5, the other 2 big social networks where small worlds really get interconnected. I think that instalation is already pretty good. But the part about figuring out the various types of keys, etc., is a bit lacking in their obviousness.
[23:28] <_ph00> it *is* easy
[23:28] <_ph00> well, it's not for computer illiterate ppl
[23:28] <grongbong> Hopefully, in the next major release of freenet, you'll develop a simple guide to the fundaments of freenet, and its features.
[23:28] <grongbong> yes, it's easy.
[23:29] <grongbong> exactly, not for computer iliterate people,
[23:29] <_ph00> but usually, it doesn't take long to make them understand
[23:29] <_ph00> and
[23:29] <_ph00> you are right, no one is using true darknet
[23:29] <grongbong> Of course, it's not black magic :)
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[23:30] <_ph00> but learning how to use darknet, and why you want to use it, is already a big step in the right direction
[23:30] <grongbong> yeah.
[23:30] <_ph00> many people want opennet because it's easier
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[23:31] <grongbong> easier to conect to the world-scale freenet .
[23:31] <grongbong> ?
[23:32] <_ph00> but darknet "forces" them to use irc, knw people who run freenet, so many of them do unerstand why darknet is needed, after a while. Of course, uding darknet as we are doing now "hey you perfect stranger, how'bout swapping refs with me? oh, btw, I could be a terrorist, and NSA agent, or bot..."
[23:32] <grongbong> My friends with whom I've been talking about this fall into the "computer iliterate" people (or is it that computers are people iliterate?)
[23:32] <_ph00> that's just as unsafe as using opennet
[23:32] <_ph00> but as I said, learning how to use darknet and why, is also important
[23:32] <_ph00> many people (expecially computer illiterate)
[23:33] <_ph00> don't undertand one basic fact:
[23:33] <_ph00> computers are stupid
[23:33] <_ph00> you know that, I know... but people who don't know computer more that click the blue ball to see internet, they expect computers to be intelligent
[23:34] * skyye (n=fandy_ex@) Quit ()
[23:34] <grongbong> I think they do! They just don't have the time and past-experience to learn that stupidity.
[23:35] <grongbong> you should hear the name-calling you can hear when you bring them together!
[23:35] <_ph00> ayways, freenet is fairly easy to use now, there are faq's and wiki, and irc support channels... just anyone can do it, even know-nothing users
[23:36] <grongbong> yes.Mmy main question was answered, so thank you.
[23:36] <_ph00> it was?
[23:36] <grongbong> the question about anyone using freenet in a truly friend to friend way.
[23:36] <_ph00> oh yeah, about true darknet
[23:37] <_ph00> no one afaik
[23:37] <grongbong> Opennet then seems to be a good way forward.
[23:37] <_ph00> some run a halfway version, like not connecting to people they just met, like "who wanna connect?"
[23:38] <_ph00> but not even poeple they actually know and trust
[23:38] <grongbong> That, or highly saturize the world with propaganda about freenet that some section of the population will try it and love it.
[23:38] <grongbong> right.
[23:38] <_ph00> mostly sople they have known here for some tiome
[23:38] <_ph00> time*
[23:38] <grongbong> That's a good question that arises when we think about that.
[23:38] <_ph00> about true darknet?
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[23:38] <_ph00> the problem is that we are too few
[23:39] <_ph00> no one has enough friends who run freenet
[23:39] <_ph00> most ppl have none
[23:39] <grongbong> about the level of trust you have on other people you conect to in a darknet system.
[23:39] <_ph00> so we have to take "internet friends"
[23:39] <_ph00> we can't afford to be too selective on that one, as we are few
[23:40] <_ph00> but
[23:40] <_ph00> staying here, one can learn to know some internet frioends, and ficgure out who can be trusted
[23:40] <TheSeeker> in the real world, 'small world' studies have never been done, as far as I know, where the people involved with forwarding information were limited to people they trust deeply :P most connections people have with other people are very shallow.
[23:40] <grongbong> I kind of do some design work, and, if before the launch of the next release of freenet, you guys anounced some kind of contest for creating anything about the new release, freenet or darknet concepts in general, I would try creating something.
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[23:41] <_ph00> of course, that's not easy... but on the other hand, even people you knaow facve to face can turn out to be a spy, or somthing
[23:41] <_ph00> well do that, the devs are always happy when people want to get involved
[23:41] <TheSeeker> which just goes to further show that basing a network on trust is a failed idea from the start.
[23:42] <grongbong> To try to bridge the hacker-crypto-guy world and the thousands of new people "coming" to the internet each week.
[23:44] <grongbong> TheSeeker: At least in the USA, there's been a study which confirmed what you said. Americans have less intimate friends now than they did 40-some years ago.
[23:45] <grongbong> _ph00: I'll keep a watch on freenet releases and do something near the next one (the one with Opennet?) but again, making a wider caller could also be a good idea.
[23:46] <_ph00> freenet 8 could take some time...
[23:46] <_ph00> I'm no dev btw
[23:46] <_ph00> contact toad and neztgens
[23:46] <_ph00> x
[23:46] <_ph00> they are two of the major devs, and they are often on line here
[23:48] <TheSeeker> toad's been away for a while, wonder what he's up to? he had just been on vacation recently, did he take another one? :P
[23:48] <_ph00> yeah
[23:49] <_ph00> he's spending the big donation money :)
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[23:49] <grongbong> ok, thanks.
[23:51] <grongbong> Bye all.
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